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Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 2:09 pm
by katastrofa
It's actually chemistry, not physics. Quantum chemistry. I completed a BSc course in chemistry and even planned of continuing in this particular specialisation. It was many years ago, but the above problem is quite basics.

OK, if it is undergrad level, surely there must be a book discussing the topic?
The posts are very wordy... why no equation?
I usually post equations, but I felt that you needed an intro - it is a good old (sadly forgotten) scientific tradition to acquire some culture before applying the method. My post is not "wordy" - these are keywords for your friend. He can now search them in books or online. I studied in Poland and the basic book was quantum chemistry by Prof. Kolos. It's possibly in the PhD curriculum at western unis.

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 2:16 pm
by katastrofa
what's with quantum mechanics in geology anyway?
what happened to "rocks for jocks?"
Where have you been for the last decade? Now every jock talks quantum mechanics.

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 3:26 pm
by Cuchulainn
It's actually chemistry, not physics. Quantum chemistry. I completed a BSc course in chemistry and even planned of continuing in this particular specialisation. It was many years ago, but the above problem is quite basics.

OK, if it is undergrad level, surely there must be a book discussing the topic?
The posts are very wordy... why no equation?
I usually post equations, but I felt that you needed an intro - it is a good old (sadly forgotten) scientific tradition to acquire some culture before applying the method. My post is not "wordy" - these are keywords for your friend. He can now search them in books or online. I studied in Poland and the basic book was quantum chemistry by Prof. Kolos. It's possibly in the PhD curriculum at western unis.
Fair enough!  My geology friend should first immerse himself in background study. I am hoping that we will end up with equation eventually.

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 3:29 pm
by Cuchulainn
what's with quantum mechanics in geology anyway?
what happened to "rocks for jocks?"
Where have you been for the last decade? Now every jock talks quantum mechanics.
I suspect ppauper is more interested in Rock of Ages and not age of rocks, what?
But the question is indeed "what do you want to achieve/measure etc."?

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 3:46 pm
by katastrofa
It's actually chemistry, not physics. Quantum chemistry. I completed a BSc course in chemistry and even planned of continuing in this particular specialisation. It was many years ago, but the above problem is quite basics.

OK, if it is undergrad level, surely there must be a book discussing the topic?
The posts are very wordy... why no equation?
I usually post equations, but I felt that you needed an intro - it is a good old (sadly forgotten) scientific tradition to acquire some culture before applying the method. My post is not "wordy" - these are keywords for your friend. He can now search them in books or online. I studied in Poland and the basic book was quantum chemistry by Prof. Kolos. It's possibly in the PhD curriculum at western unis.
Fair enough!
FIRST QUESTION:
Which theory is being broken for the energy state to become 'forbidden'?

No theory is being broken. Just the standard selection rules do not apply - one requires a more complicated model because of the presence of spin-orbit coupling (the consequence of the crystal symmetry). The transition momentum which would have null probability in the absence of the coupling becomes slightly non-zero due to this correction.

SECOND QUESTION:
Could  you explain the quantum mechanics required for the storage of this 'forbidden energy' in the phosphorescence of crystalline minerals please?
The question is awkward. "Forbidden energy" and "quantum mechanics required for its storage"? Commander Shepard in Mass Effect used more scientifically accurate language. Spin-orbit coupling causes phosphorescence in your colleagues case. There can be other effects which violate the simple selection rules and allow non-zero transition probability, though (e.g. many-body interactions or dipole moment of the investigated body/molecule).

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 23rd, 2018, 3:55 pm
by Collector
The key-wordy-equation a good start! any simple back of the envelop equations ?

or ask the rock: which ones on display are just fluorescence and which are phosphorescent? Supposedly the philosophers stone gives off light in all the colors of the rainbow when in a special state, after days heated in the crucible (in very old books, not new age fantasies). The experimental quantum chemists!

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 24th, 2018, 9:34 am
by Cuchulainn
Dear Danny,


You were right....a beautiful answer from katastrofa in Alpha Centauri, a beautiful star system 

Could you pass on my thanks please.

And so much delightful information on my rock....such a pleasure. 

I may have another question soon......


Go raibh mile a maith agat agus go eiri an bothar leat

TLC

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: September 5th, 2018, 9:25 am
by Cuchulainn
A friend of mine who is a geologist. He has questions and I thought some Wilmotters can shine their light on the problem. Thanks for your help..

//

Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.
I believe that there is a bi-polar magnetic flip by the electron as it returns from its excited state to original position. The electron is emitting protons from stored energy as it does this 'flip'
The absorption, storing and readmitting of energy, albeit at a different wavelength, interests me.
I guess that it's the 'storage of energy' that should be of real interest here??
Danny you asked me to provide one question to be broken into mathematics ...
might have to be two questions which will need two answers each..one in maths, one in english
The word 'Forbidden' is what interests me in the above statement.
 
FIRST QUESTION:
Which theory is being broken for the energy state to become 'forbidden'?
and also
SECOND QUESTION:
Could  you explain the quantum mechanics required for the storage of this 'forbidden energy' in the phosphorescence of crystalline minerals please?
edit: 'admitting' changed to 'emitting'.

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: September 5th, 2018, 9:29 am
by ppauper
should "readmitting" also be changed?

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: September 5th, 2018, 7:49 pm
by Cuchulainn
should "readmitting" also be changed?
To reemitting?

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 14th, 2019, 2:49 pm
by ISayMoo
Feynman didn't understand many things, judging from all the errors in his Lectures.
He was also an asshole to women: https://thebaffler.com/outbursts/surely ... an-mcneill

Re: Forbidden energy states in the quantum mechanics of phosphorescent crystalline minerals.

Posted: August 14th, 2019, 4:15 pm
by Cuchulainn
He put many souls on the wrong path with his negative probabilities, so he did.