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Hamilton
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November 2nd, 2006, 4:25 pm

Quote"If you take uncovered meat and put it on the street ... without a cover and the cats eat it, is it the fault of the cat or the uncovered meat?" the sheik asked in his sermon given before 500 worshippers at Lakemba Mosque. "The uncovered meat is the problem. If the meat was covered, the cats wouldn't roam around it. If the meat is inside the fridge, they won't get it ... if the woman is in her boudoir, in her house and if she's wearing the veil and if she shows modesty, disasters don't happen."helpful home cooking tips from Sheik Taj el-Dene Elhilaly, Grand Mufti of Australia's 350,000 Muslims.
 
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Marsden
Topic Author
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November 2nd, 2006, 6:24 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: HamiltonPlato believed in fascism. There is considerable debate amongst scholars as to whether he quite literally believed this in the City of Man, or meant this as an allusion to a theological state. But, feel free to assert unconditionally without qualification. I assume, also, that your use of the Genetic Fallacy:"He's a fascist, so there is no reason to listen to anything he says"is on full display.Who are you quoting here?
 
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Hamilton
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November 2nd, 2006, 6:59 pm

"During the ongoing trial of another Dutch terrorism suspect, Samir Azzouz, it's emerged that Imam Fawaz of the as-Sunnah mosque in The Hague gave a sermon condemning Theo van Gogh just a few weeks before his murder. A recording of the sermon exists and in it the imam is heard uttering a curse against the Dutch director for his film Submission, which is critical of Islam. The film had been shown on television shortly before the sermon."In the recording of the sermon, Imam Fawaz calls Theo van Gogh a 'criminal bastard' and beseeches Allah to visit an incurable disease upon the filmmaker. He also condemns former Dutch MP Ayaan Hirsi Ali who was involved in writing the script for Submission. The imam asks Allah to make Ms Hirsi Ali go blind and give her cancer of the tongue and brain."Peace be upon you
 
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Hamilton
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November 2nd, 2006, 7:01 pm

QuoteBut why kill Theo Van Gogh, of all the people who have expressed hostility to radical Islam? Perhaps it was mere chance, but more likely it resulted from his work’s exposure of a very raw nerve of Muslim identity in Western Europe: the abuse of womenQuoteReligious sanction for the oppression of women (whether theologically justified or not) is hence the main attraction of Islam to young men in an increasingly secular world. This explains why a divide often opens between brothers and sisters in the same European Muslim family; the sisters want liberty, but the brothers enforce the old rules. They have to, or the whole gratifying system breaks down.Why Theo Van Gogh was murdered
 
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TraderJoe
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November 2nd, 2006, 11:18 pm

Forget it.
Last edited by TraderJoe on November 2nd, 2006, 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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mencey
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November 2nd, 2006, 11:46 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: MarsdenQuoteI must disagree with you, however, on the basis of US law. It is only under the 14th Amendment to the Constitution (enacted in the middle of the 19th century), I believe, that the concept of "equal protection of the laws" is introduced to US law.The real difference comes into play with democracy. (I'm not familiar at all with sharia, but I think that, within the limits imposed by the many immutable, divinely given laws of sharia, democracy or at least government for the benefit of the people in general is preferred, which is not too different from US law.)I am neither an expert on Sharia law but I guess what is proposed under Sharia is a theocratic regime, the rules of the priests according to the divine rules of the Koran, etc... Quote"Democracy" is a very miss-used word these days: what it really is is government by the majority; but when it is used in the news it is generally meant to indicate a system of individual rights and justice in addition to some form of majority-determined elections. We commonly accept that democracy is "fair," or at least more "fair" than anything else, but it really is not inherently so: in a pure form, the majority could just decide to exterminate minorities and be fully compatible with democracy.That's why I prefer the concept of open society to the concept of democracy. See below from www.soros.org What is an "open society"?An open society is a society based on the recognition that nobody has a monopoly on the truth, that different people have different views and interests, and that there is a need for institutions to protect the rights of all people to allow them to live together in peace. Broadly speaking, an open society is characterized by a reliance on the rule of law, the existence of a democratically elected government, a diverse and vigorous civil society, and respect for minorities and minority opinions.The term "open society" was popularized by the philosopher Karl Popper in his 1945 book Open Society and Its Enemies. Popper's work deeply influenced George Soros, the founder of the Open Society Institute, and it is upon the concept of an open society that Soros bases his philanthropic activity.
 
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mencey
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November 2nd, 2006, 11:55 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: MarsdenThe real difference, I think, is that in US law, everything is mutableThat's exactly the beauty of it. As law is mutable it can adapt itself to a changing reality. When law can not change because is based in dogma (someone thinks it was given by God and therefore he is in posetion of the absolute truth) then societies can not addapt to changing reality and gap between reality and dogma widens. Popper says that when that gap widens, the only way the "dogmatic" status quo can be manteined is through violence and represion.
 
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TraderJoe
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November 2nd, 2006, 11:55 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: menceyQuoteOriginally posted by: MarsdenQuoteI must disagree with you, however, on the basis of US law. It is only under the 14th Amendment to the Constitution (enacted in the middle of the 19th century), I believe, that the concept of "equal protection of the laws" is introduced to US law.The real difference comes into play with democracy. (I'm not familiar at all with sharia, but I think that, within the limits imposed by the many immutable, divinely given laws of sharia, democracy or at least government for the benefit of the people in general is preferred, which is not too different from US law.)I am neither an expert on Sharia law but I guess what is proposed under Sharia is a theocratic regime, the rules of the priests according to the divine rules of the Koran, etc... ShariaQuoteSharia refers to the body of Islamic law. The term means "way" or "path"; it is the legal framework within which public and some private aspects of life are regulated for those living in a legal system based on Muslim principles of jurisprudence.Sharia deals with many aspects of day-to-day life, including politics, economics, banking, business law, contract law, sexuality, and social issues. Some Islamic scholars accept Sharia as the body of precedent and legal theory established before the 19th century, while other scholars view Sharia as a changing body, and include Islamic legal theory from the contemporary period.[citation needed]Before the 19th century, legal theory was considered the domain of the traditional legal schools of thought. Most Sunni Muslims follow Hanafi, Hanbali, Maliki or Shafii, while most Shia Muslims follow Jaafari (Hallaq 1997, Brown 1996, Aslan 2006).
 
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Hamilton
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Joined: July 23rd, 2001, 6:25 pm

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November 3rd, 2006, 2:41 am

QuoteFemale genital cutting is performed by Muslims and non-Muslims alike across East Africa and the Nile Valley, as well as parts of the Arabian peninsula and Southeast Asia. It is not part of mainstream Islam, although it is justified and explained as an islamic prescription by many Muslims from North-African and Arabian origin (especially in Egypt, Sudan, Eritrea, Somalia and Yemen). It is not practiced in Maghreb countries and most of Asia, but is performed by Muslims and non-Muslims alike across East Africa and the Nile Valley, as well as parts of the Arabian peninsula and Southeast Asia. In both areas, the custom predates Islam. Many Muslims believe that female circumcision is required by Islam, but a large number of Muslims believe this practice has no basis in Islam. Nevertheless it is justified on religious grounds by Muslims who practice it, mostly in parts of Africa, and also by islamists as Yusuf Al-Qaradawi. [citation needed]The Egyptian-born president of the European Council for Fatwa and Research, Yusuf al-Qaradawi, emphasises that this is not a religious obligation, but expresses his personal preference for removal of the prepuce of the clitoris, called clitoridotomy (Fatwa on islamonline.net.), one gradationn less then complete removal of organs.The use of the term 'circumcision' is highly confusing, as the practice ranges from a mild superficial act that does not reduce any physiological function (the 'real' circumcision) to various forms of partial or even complete removal of female genital organs. In certain countries, this is accompanied by reducing the genital opening. These forms are, because of their brutal nature, also referred to as female genital mutilation (FGM). This term is most often used in official publications of the United Nations and World Health Organization.
 
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Hamilton
Posts: 5976
Joined: July 23rd, 2001, 6:25 pm

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November 3rd, 2006, 2:45 am

QuoteApostasy in Islam (Arabic: ارتداد, irtidād or ridda) is commonly defined as the rejection of Islam in word or deed by a person who has been a Muslim.All five major schools of Islamic jurisprudence agree that a sane male apostate must be executed. A female apostate may be put to death, according to some schools, or imprisoned, according to others.
 
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Hamilton
Posts: 5976
Joined: July 23rd, 2001, 6:25 pm

Methods of Inquiry

November 3rd, 2006, 2:52 am

QuoteHossam Armanious, a Coptic Christian from Jersey City, N.J., who was found murdered earlier this month, frequently debated with Muslims on PalTalk. Two months before Armanious's murder, authorities said he received a death threat from a Muslim PalTalk user: "You'd better stop this bull ... or we are going to track you down like a chicken and kill you." On January 14, Armanious and his family -- including two daughters, ages 15 and 8 -- were found killed in their Jersey City home, bound and gagged with their throats slashed.
 
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Hamilton
Posts: 5976
Joined: July 23rd, 2001, 6:25 pm

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November 3rd, 2006, 2:53 am

QuoteAuthor Robert Spencer, who has been following the Armanious case for his Web site Jihad Watch, described barsomyat.com as "extremely important" after it was shown to him."I have never seen anything like this before," Mr. Spencer said. "It's chilling to see photographs of people who probably have no idea that they're on the Web site. Hamas's Web site would post self-congratulatory accounts of their attacks on civilians, but barsomyat.com's users are telegraphiing their intended victims in advance."Mr. Spencer added that barsomyat.com is a "prime example" of how some Islamic extremists can utilize technology to attempt to bring Islamic religious law to the West."We saw in the Theo van Gogh murders that some Muslims will take these kinds of matters into their own hands," Mr. Spencer said. "The Internet makes it easier for them to do so by disseminating this kind of information. You could imagine 15 years ago how hard it would be for people to get this much information on people who they believe should be killed."Barsomyat.com is registered to Viza-Web Inc., a Web hosting company based in Woodbury, Minn.Someone is watching you
 
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trackstar
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Joined: August 28th, 2008, 1:53 pm

Methods of Inquiry

June 13th, 2010, 12:54 am

Marsden v. Hamilton,with input from some of the usual suspects...
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