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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

January 24th, 2017, 12:02 pm

Continuing with the literary analogy

His rhetorical style is nothing more than stream of consciousness, floating from one thought to another, frequently unrelated, thought. Much of his seemingly interior monologue is in praise of himself — how great, strong, brilliant, smart he is — while attacking, belittling and demeaning anyone who dares to question Donald Trump. — Mitchell McKinney, a communications professor who teaches political communication and rhetorical theory and criticism at the University of Missouri-Columbia

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/ne ... rylink=cpy
 
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Traden4Alpha
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

January 26th, 2017, 1:57 am

Trump and Joyce may share a penchant for stream of consciousness writing, but Trump seems as shallow as Joyce is deep.
 
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trackstar
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

January 26th, 2017, 2:23 am

The narrative fallacy addresses our limited ability to look at sequences of facts without weaving an explanation into them, or, equivalently, forcing a logical link, an arrow of relationship upon them. Explanations bind facts together. They make them all the more easily remembered; they help them make more sense. 
Where this propensity can go wrong is when it increases our impression of understanding.
—Nassim Nicholas Taleb, The Black Swan
 
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katastrofa
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 1st, 2017, 10:34 pm

"A destiny that leads the English to the Dutch is strange enough; but one that leads from Epsom into Pennsylvania, and thence into the hills that shut in Altamont over the proud coral cry of the cock, and the soft stone smile of an angel, is touched by that dark miracle of chance which makes new magic in a dusty world.

Each of us is all the sums he has not counted: subtract us into nakedness and night again, and you shall see begin in Crete four thousand years ago the love that ended yesterday in Texas.

The seed of our destruction will blossom in the desert, the alexin of our cure grows by a mountain rock, and our lives are haunted by a Georgia slattern, because a London cutpurse went unhung. Each moment is the fruit of forty thousand years. The minute-winning days, like flies, buzz home to death, and every moment is a window on all time."

(I looked at the quote in the previous post and felt like a profaner.)

Cuchlainn, was Joyce also inspired by Milton?
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 1st, 2017, 11:57 pm

No doubt, Joyce did instill a great quantity of intentional meaning in his book.I wonder, though, to what extent all the analysis and criticism of a book such as FW isn't the literary equivalent of technical analysis.  For better or worse, humans are extremely deft at finding patterns in both arrays of numbers and strings of text.  I'm sure its possible to read all manner of meaning into Joyce's enigmatic words, but how much of it is overfitting?  How much of the Viconian Cycle analysis is the equivalent to Elliot Waves, Gann Angles, and Fibonacci numbers???  Can we ever know?The big difference between literary analysis and market data analysis is that the market eventually reveals the true answer to provide an reckoning of the analysts.  We can spot the overfitters by their trading losses.  No such analog occurs on the literary side, especially after the author is dead.  It's too bad that Joyce didn't create a time-locked Answer Guide (or at least a dictionary) to Finnigans.
Wrong. It's all in the Vico cycles.

Image
 
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Traden4Alpha
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 12:02 am

No doubt, Joyce did instill a great quantity of intentional meaning in his book.I wonder, though, to what extent all the analysis and criticism of a book such as FW isn't the literary equivalent of technical analysis.  For better or worse, humans are extremely deft at finding patterns in both arrays of numbers and strings of text.  I'm sure its possible to read all manner of meaning into Joyce's enigmatic words, but how much of it is overfitting?  How much of the Viconian Cycle analysis is the equivalent to Elliot Waves, Gann Angles, and Fibonacci numbers???  Can we ever know?The big difference between literary analysis and market data analysis is that the market eventually reveals the true answer to provide an reckoning of the analysts.  We can spot the overfitters by their trading losses.  No such analog occurs on the literary side, especially after the author is dead.  It's too bad that Joyce didn't create a time-locked Answer Guide (or at least a dictionary) to Finnigans.
Wrong. It's all in the Vico cycles.

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Veni, vidi, vico?
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 8:20 am


(I looked at the quote in the previous post and felt like a profaner.)

Cuchlainn, was Joyce also inspired by Milton?
yeah, I think it was just a slip. Throwing greatness on someone is a huge responsibility.
Joyce - as you know - sufferred from glaucoma. The ancient bards Milton and Homer also failed eye test, so maybe yes is the answer.
Stephen closed his eyes to hear his boots crush crackling wrack and shells. You are walking through it howsomever. I am, a stride at a time. A very short space of time through very short times of space. Five, six: the nacheinander. Exactly: and that is the ineluctable modality of the audible. Open your eyes. No. Jesus! If I fell over a cliff that beetles o'er his base, fell through the nebeneinander ineluctably. I am getting on nicely in the dark. My ash sword hangs at my side. Tap with it: they do. My two feet in his boots are at the end of his legs, nebeneinander. Sounds solid: made by the mallet of Los Demiurgos. Am I walking into eternity along Sandymount strand? Crush, crack, crick, crick. Wild sea money. Dominie Deasy kens them a'.


BTW katastrofa, have you ever walked on Sandymount strand?
Last edited by Cuchulainn on February 2nd, 2017, 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 8:23 am

No doubt, Joyce did instill a great quantity of intentional meaning in his book.I wonder, though, to what extent all the analysis and criticism of a book such as FW isn't the literary equivalent of technical analysis.  For better or worse, humans are extremely deft at finding patterns in both arrays of numbers and strings of text.  I'm sure its possible to read all manner of meaning into Joyce's enigmatic words, but how much of it is overfitting?  How much of the Viconian Cycle analysis is the equivalent to Elliot Waves, Gann Angles, and Fibonacci numbers???  Can we ever know?The big difference between literary analysis and market data analysis is that the market eventually reveals the true answer to provide an reckoning of the analysts.  We can spot the overfitters by their trading losses.  No such analog occurs on the literary side, especially after the author is dead.  It's too bad that Joyce didn't create a time-locked Answer Guide (or at least a dictionary) to Finnigans.
Wrong. It's all in the Vico cycles.

Image
Veni, vidi, vico?
"I've put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that's the only way of insuring one's immortality."

A bit like Trump?
 
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Traden4Alpha
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 1:31 pm

Wrong. It's all in the Vico cycles.

Image
Veni, vidi, vico?
"I've put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that's the only way of insuring one's immortality."

A bit like Trump?
There are no enigmas or puzzles with Trump.
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 2:22 pm

Veni, vidi, vico?
"I've put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that's the only way of insuring one's immortality."

A bit like Trump?
There are no enigmas or puzzles with Trump.
bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnuk!
 
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Traden4Alpha
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 2nd, 2017, 2:56 pm

"I've put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that's the only way of insuring one's immortality."

A bit like Trump?
There are no enigmas or puzzles with Trump.
bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnuk!
Obviously!
 
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katastrofa
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 3rd, 2017, 12:10 am

yeah, I think it was just a slip. Throwing greatness on someone is a huge responsibility.
That's why I always debase them.
Joyce - as you know - sufferred from glaucoma. The ancient bards Milton and Homer also failed eye test, so maybe yes is the answer.
Stephen closed his eyes to hear his boots crush crackling wrack and shells. You are walking through it howsomever. I am, a stride at a time. A very short space of time through very short times of space. Five, six: the nacheinander. Exactly: and that is the ineluctable modality of the audible. Open your eyes. No. Jesus! If I fell over a cliff that beetles o'er his base, fell through the nebeneinander ineluctably. I am getting on nicely in the dark. My ash sword hangs at my side. Tap with it: they do. My two feet in his boots are at the end of his legs, nebeneinander. Sounds solid: made by the mallet of Los Demiurgos. Am I walking into eternity along Sandymount strand? Crush, crack, crick, crick. Wild sea money. Dominie Deasy kens them a'.


BTW katastrofa, have you ever walked on Sandymount strand?
I've actually never been to Ireland :-( I always jaunt to Scotland, moi rah. It rang the bell though and haunted me the whole day until I found the right church! "I stoop'd down and bound it on to walk forward thro' Eternity." I initially meant the actual, not Blake's Milton, and his influence on Joyce's writing, not some spiritual inspiration, but now I can see the clear reference.
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

February 4th, 2017, 8:02 am

Steve Bannon believes in Viconian Cycles. I've been trying to tell T4A this for the last 10 years.

President Trump’s adviser, Steve Bannon, is on the cover of this week’s Time magazine, and in the piece it is revealed that Bannon deeply believes in a theory about America’s future laid out in a book called “The Fourth Turning: What Cycles of History Tell Us About America’s Next Rendezvous with Destiny.”
This fact should concern every American.
In the book, authors William Strauss and Neil Howe theorize that the history of a people moves in 80-to-100 year cycles called “saecula.” The idea goes back to the ancient Greeks, who believed that at a given saeculum’s end, there would come “ekpyrosis,” a cataclysmic event that destroys the old order and brings in a new one in a trial of fire.
This era of change is known as the Fourth Turning, and Bannon, like Strauss and Howe, believes we are in the midst of one right now.
According to the book, the last two Fourth Turnings that America experienced were the Civil War and the Reconstruction, and then the Great Depression and World War II. Before that, it was the Revolutionary War.
All these were marked by periods of dread and decay in which the American people were forced to unite to rebuild a new future, but only after a massive conflict in which many lives were lost. It all starts with a catalyst event, then there’s a period of regeneracy, after that there is a defining climax in which a war for the old order is fought, and then finally there is a resolution in which a new world order is stabilized.
This is where Bannon’s obsession with this book should cause concern. He believes that, for the new world order to rise, there must be a massive reckoning. That we will soon reach our climax conflict. In the White House, he has shown that he is willing to advise Trump to enact policies that will disrupt our current order to bring about what he perceives as a necessary new one. He encourages breaking down political and economic alliances and turning away from traditional American principles to cause chaos.
In that way, Bannon seems to be trying to bring about the Fourth Turning. 
 
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

June 8th, 2017, 8:09 pm

James Joyce is a good model for punctuation he keeps it to an absolute minimum there’s no reason to blot the page up with weird little marks i mean if you write properly you shouldn’t have to punctuate


Take note, all you Europeans!
 
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Traden4Alpha
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Re: Finnegans Wake, by James Joyce

June 8th, 2017, 8:18 pm

LOL! I'd consider Finnegans Wake to exemplify anti-patterns in the realm of clear communication.
bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnuk!
This needs more of those weird little marks!
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