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Cuchulainn
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 12th, 2013, 5:11 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?
 
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Traden4Alpha
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 12th, 2013, 8:07 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?Knights who say neeessan?
 
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Cuchulainn
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 13th, 2013, 10:37 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?Knights who say neeessan?It's enough to drive me round the benz!
 
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Traden4Alpha
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 13th, 2013, 12:01 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?Knights who say neeessan?It's enough to drive me round the benz!Or did vee double ya pleasure?
 
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Cuchulainn
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 13th, 2013, 12:05 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?Knights who say neeessan?It's enough to drive me round the benz!Or did vee double ya pleasure?Bee emmm dubble ewe?
 
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Traden4Alpha
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 13th, 2013, 12:51 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnQuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: CuchulainnLeft-wing guys tend to have left-wing mothers-in-law, left-wing kids and pets, and drive in left-wing Swedish cars.Tis a reVolvoing door, what?Yes, energy-saabing.It's scaniadalous.Pining for the Fords? That's really daf-t.Can't help getting vauxhall sentimental, now that 'es porsching up the daisies.How far are we?Quite far around the bend of bay if we are land rovers.Can we a ford a far are wee or will that cause ehaustive convolvsions?Peugought to know we can't a ford anything with fiat money. I gotta get audi here before I lose all 'opel sanity!(P.S. is the gold standard a "right-wing" or "left-wing" concept????)Su bar u?Knights who say neeessan?It's enough to drive me round the benz!Or did vee double ya pleasure?Bee emmm dubble ewe?Cry, seller?
 
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exneratunrisk
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Joined: April 20th, 2004, 12:25 pm

why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 7:26 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: Traden4AlphaQuoteOriginally posted by: exneratunriskSo a "real left-wing" wants a market liberation, the orthogonalization of economy and the social system and sharing. Instruments would be unconditioned basic income, changing the reference system for progressive tax from wages to income, cancel all subsidies, ...and ... drumroll ... organize a slim government that concentrates on hard and soft infrastructure.First, let me wholehearted agree with the goal of "a slim government that concentrates on hard and soft infrastructure." And the concept of the orthogonalization of economy and the social system seems attractive on the surface. But is it possible? To the extent that the "social system" involves any transfers of money or money-like instruments, it immediately becomes non-orthogonal to the economy. The redistribution of money among producers and consumers can't help but change economic patterns of production and consumption.∂Standard_of_Living/∂Labour: how do social policies modulate returns on labour?∂Standard_of_Living/∂Savings: how do social policies modulate returns on savings?∂Standard_of_Living/∂Risk_Taking: how do social policies modulate the expected value of risky investments?Or, more generally, what is:Standard_of_Living( Person_i | Decisions_and_Actions(Person_i) )A central challenge to government is to skim enough resources from the economy to provide vital services/infrastructure to that economy without stunting the very economy that the government depends on.Commercial street and working streetIf cs is not greedy it harms itself - if cs is too greedy it harms ws and consequently itselfIf ws does not want more it harms itself - if ws wants too much it harms cs and consequently itselfThis is co-evolution and IMO it doesn't make any sense if the one side claims cs should be more social and the other side ws should be more commercial.But the government could make some fundamental decisions, like installing an unconditioned basic income. This would set the co-evolution to another level and and have significant structural consequences (the quality of work and the quality of the economic outputs as well as the will to enter into more risky investments).This is discussed here for decades, but, I guess, the Swiss will be the first to install it.
Last edited by exneratunrisk on October 13th, 2013, 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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katastrofa
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 8:09 am

"But the government could make some fundamental decisions, like installing an unconditioned basic income."I wonder if this would fit human nature. People are not happy when someone gives them a handout. People are happy when they have a job which pays them a decent living wage.
 
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exneratunrisk
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 10:25 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: katastrofa"But the government could make some fundamental decisions, like installing an unconditioned basic income."I wonder if this would fit human nature. People are not happy when someone gives them a handout. People are happy when they have a job which pays them a decent living wage.1. who has ever tested this hypothesis? 2. how many jobs will be available after "technology singularity"? (do you think in about 20 years there will be more quant jobs?)3. is partial self-catering not a job?
 
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katastrofa
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 10:36 am

"who has ever tested this hypothesis?"Look at post-mining towns in the UK or Poland (Silesia). Miners in Silesia were given huge (for Polish standards) handouts to convince them to quit their jobs in the mines. Most of them are far from happy now."how many jobs will be available after "technology singularity"? (do you think in about 20 years there will be more quant jobs?)"Different economic systems produce different levels of employment."is partial self-catering not a job"What is it?
 
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exneratunrisk
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Joined: April 20th, 2004, 12:25 pm

why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 10:47 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: katastrofa"who has ever tested this hypothesis?"Look at post-mining towns in the UK or Poland (Silesia). Miners in Silesia were given huge (for Polish standards) handouts to convince them to quit their jobs in the mines. Most of them are far from happy now."how many jobs will be available after "technology singularity"? (do you think in about 20 years there will be more quant jobs?)"Different economic systems produce different levels of employment."is partial self-catering not a job"What is it?1. partial is not unconditioned2. I just can refer to studies in the USA that jobs will become less and polarized (MIT?)3. whatever you like, grow your own "tomato", taylor your own "suit" or write your own "automation systems"
Last edited by exneratunrisk on October 13th, 2013, 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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katastrofa
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 11:03 am

"partial is not unconditioned"If you instill in people the notion that everyone is entitled to receiving $1000 (for the sake of argument) a month, people will start measuring social success/failure rebased from that. I.e. not making anything above $1000/month will place you at the bottom of the social ladder. The "only" difference (huge one! I admit) will be that you won't sleep on the streets. Humans are wired that way. Part of the jockeying about money and well-paying jobs is the need to establish social hierarchy. This creates two problems: A) harms cooperation between people and B) many people who lose the fight for dominance take it badly." I just can refer to studies in the USA that jobs will become less and polarized (MIT?)"Don't these studies assume that the current political and macroeconomic conditions will persist?"whatever you like, grow your own "tomato", taylor your own "suit" or write your own "automation systems""I think you'll find that most people require external validation of their effort, e.g. someone accepting the fruits of their work based on their own assessment of their quality. In simple words, almost everyone wants a pat on the back and a feeling that they've earned it.
 
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farmer
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Joined: December 16th, 2002, 7:09 am

why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 11:31 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: katastrofaThe "only" difference (huge one! I admit) will be that you won't sleep on the streets.You don't know much about people who sleep on the streets. Give them a million dollars, you will still know where to find them.
 
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katastrofa
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 11:53 am

In a boardroom?
 
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Marsden
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why are some guys left-wing?

October 14th, 2013, 12:08 pm

"I hear guys who are left-wing arguing such stupid positions, I wonder what is wrong with them."Wouldn't it be nice if you could just mind your own business, and not have to worry so much about what other people -- people you don't even know -- are thinking?
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