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amerikan
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 6th, 2008, 1:01 am

HiI found a program in Financial mathematics and economics. Interesting combination if you ask me, but I thought I would better ask the expertsHere's the program plan:http://www.economics.nuig.ie/ugrad/fme- ... rses.pdfDo you think this is good from a job market perspective? Seems like the job market for quants is a bit shaky, so perhaps being able to work as an economist isn't that bad? Or will this program make you "half quant, half economist", and therefore make you unable to work in either profession?I'm in need for some advice, thanks in advance/John
 
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Cuchulainn
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 6th, 2008, 1:02 pm

Can't say much about the contents.But Galway should be nice place. Next village is Boston!
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amerikan
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 6th, 2008, 2:27 pm

Galway? Boston? Hm, are we talking about the same place? Galway is in the republic of Ireland, what does that have to do with Boston, which lays in the USA?/John
 
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ZmeiGorynych
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 6th, 2008, 10:50 pm

Rather too much economics in the third year, though fourth yr courses look interesting. The market for quants is a bit thin right now, but will probably be back in full swing in 4 years. Economics the academic subject has vanishingly low usefulness to quant work.What makes you think economist jobs are easier to get than quant jobs? I'm pretty certain they are paid quite a bit less, too.
 
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amerikan
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 7th, 2008, 1:06 am

What makes me think economist jobs are easier to get... hm, good question. Prejudices? I'll think about it, I haven't decided yet. More comments?/John
 
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Cuchulainn
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 7th, 2008, 1:25 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: amerikanGalway? Boston? Hm, are we talking about the same place? Galway is in the republic of Ireland, what does that have to do with Boston, which lays in the USA?/JohnAbsolutely. It's a much-used saying in the west of the country (Atlantic ocean!). You need to read between the lines
Last edited by Cuchulainn on September 6th, 2008, 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Step over the gap, not into it. Watch the space between platform and train.
http://www.datasimfinancial.com
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AbhiJ
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 7th, 2008, 6:50 pm

Hi,Rather than focussing too much on specialising at the moment take a variety of courses in finance mathematics and a few in other areas like law marketing etc.This is to see where you are truly interested.Quant is one of the many areas in finance.Any way you need a PhD to be a full quant.So find your interest first (if you aren't a genius and know what you ultimately wanna be) and then decide which degree you wanna pursue in future.
 
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Siberian
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 9th, 2008, 3:04 pm

I did my undergrad in joint honours math and econ and filled up all complementary courses with finance courses, that allowed me to take all phd level finance and math classes during my masters, and i do feel that a lot of times i have an upper hand vs pure quants. I might not code as well though... I never regretted taking the econ classes, gives you a greater understanding from the big picture perspective, especially if your plan is asset management and not option pricing, but for someone looking to purely create, price and hedge complex instruments on a sell side, i fail to see the benefit of econ classes, but then again what the heck do i know.Cheers,Ev
 
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amerikan
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 10th, 2008, 5:29 am

Hi siberiaI assume you think it's a good idea to study financial math and economics at the same time? I have to say I'm tempted to do it, for many different reasonsGlad to hear studying economics might not be that vasted after all.Honestly, I don't know much about what option pricing is, but I have a clue about what asset management is/John
 
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Siberian
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 10th, 2008, 12:13 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: ZmeiGorynychRather too much economics in the third year, though fourth yr courses look interesting. The market for quants is a bit thin right now, but will probably be back in full swing in 4 years. Economics the academic subject has vanishingly low usefulness to quant work.What makes you think economist jobs are easier to get than quant jobs? I'm pretty certain they are paid quite a bit less, too.I would also agree with most of Zmei's points, except for salaries for economists. They tend to become strategists, answering questions on asset allocation, people at the higher level of the food chain, so their salaries tend to be pretty high. So CSO or Chief Research on average tend to make slightly less then CIO of Chief Strategist, of course I say that with limited experience with HF and other asset managers, so my sample might not be very representative.Concerning the economist jobs, i remember going through interviews and when people see Masters Econ - even from McGill - they tend to scratch their head and ask me so what is it exactly that i know other than Supply = Demand -> Equillibrium... My friends with pure math background had similar questions after BSc, once you combine Math with CS or with Econ and Finance, then not only you know a lot more than just one field, but also people's perception of your knowledge is completely different, which helps to get your foot through the door, then it's all about you and your knowledge as opposed to just a degree on your resume.If I were to give an advice, that would be don't concentrate on just one field, combine and synthesize. It's a lot of fun too.Ev
 
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amerikan
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Joined: October 19th, 2007, 11:41 am

Financial mathematics and economics

September 10th, 2008, 7:26 pm

Hi againSo, how much would a first year, third year, fifth year and tenth year economist earn? Or, what do you think? What would the wage be in general, and in those positions you mentioned? Would it take a PhD to get a job as an economist, or to get those positions mentioned?Not concentrating on one subject = take two subjects. Seems like you think Finmath and econ is good to study at the same time. Well, I'm not sure, but I kind of think so too/John
 
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Siberian
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 10th, 2008, 8:17 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: amerikanHi againSo, how much would a first year, third year, fifth year and tenth year economist earn? Or, what do you think? What would the wage be in general, and in those positions you mentioned? Would it take a PhD to get a job as an economist, or to get those positions mentioned?Not concentrating on one subject = take two subjects. Seems like you think Finmath and econ is good to study at the same time. Well, I'm not sure, but I kind of think so too/Johnit really depends where. public sector like central banks don't pay as much, in Canada for example salaries of MAs with 0 years of experience vary from 50 to 60k. From what i hear it's not much higher at the Fed. I know a bunch of econ PhDs who whorked/working for supranationals like IMF or World Bank, salaries there tend to be much higher plus you pay no taxes, downside you have to live in dc, so... a junior level strategist who sits on the floor with traders make around 200k+bonus, but you need i think at least 3-5 yrs direct market experience. once you look at hedge funds, compensations there are just disgusting I think if you google avg salaries in the industry you will see some estimates, shouldn't be too difficult to find.As far as my advice, it really depends what you want to do, i know pure quant guys working on the sell side should be good efficient coders, so a course in any of the c's (c, c++, c# etc.) would probably be more beneficial, if you don't want to just price/hedge derivatives - which is also great fun, then econ would be a great asset imho.hope this helpsEv
 
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amerikan
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Joined: October 19th, 2007, 11:41 am

Financial mathematics and economics

September 10th, 2008, 9:22 pm

200k? Is that what you quants call a low wage? Haha, that's so... quantishHow much bonus, usually? In % of the basic wage. Sorry about bombarding you with questions, but I'm curious What about working hours/conditions?And, sorry about being a newbie, but if you got 3-5 years of market experience... are you really junior then? You mean you can't begin to work as a junior strategist, you have to work somewhere else, like for a hedgefund, before?Thank you/John G
 
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KackToodles
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Financial mathematics and economics

September 11th, 2008, 4:08 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: amerikan200k? Is that what you quants call a low wage? Haha, that's so... quantish considering that a physician (general practictioner, no PhD) with 5-10 years experience can make $350,000 for a 9-5 job in the States, $200K for a phd quant is quite low. But at least the quant could get a generous bonus whereas doctors don't get bonuses unless they own their own practice.
 
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amerikan
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Joined: October 19th, 2007, 11:41 am

Financial mathematics and economics

September 11th, 2008, 5:34 am

Okey, still, the average wage in America is 40 000/year, so both 200 000 and 350 000 seems high to me. Or is there anything I forgot?How much does it vary in working hours/bonus?/John
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