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albertmills
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Joined: March 13th, 2007, 1:09 pm

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

June 18th, 2013, 5:15 am

Hi,I have some employment opportunities at hi-tech firms - GE and the like. The problem is all hi-tech companies want you to sign agreements saying things along the lines of "we own anything you may ever invent in the future that has anything to do with our business even if you're not employed with us when you invent it" I have a desire to own my own business, and there's a chance i may get an idea while working at a company that is a solution to some problem that the business/business' customers face. I'd want to profit from this, rather than letting my employer do so (note i'm not talking about stealing an employers IP at all). For this reason I am hesitant to work at any hi-tech company, as I don't want top handcuff myself by signing over any ideas I may have to my potential employer. Is this a flawed view - that hi-tech companies aren't even worth applying to, because they all make you sign these agreements?
Last edited by albertmills on June 17th, 2013, 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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jimmybob
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Joined: May 10th, 2013, 7:24 am

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

June 18th, 2013, 8:10 am

Presumably some aspects of those contracts are not legally enforcable, although you'd want to ask a legal professional about that rather than going by what someone said on a forum.
 
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ArthurDent
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Joined: July 2nd, 2005, 4:38 pm

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

June 18th, 2013, 11:53 am

I am not a lawyer, but in the US typically companies own what you do while you are working there.When I worked at tech companies, (one startup, one midsized firm, one household name) I was asked on day 1 to sign invention forms listing all patents and inventions I owned prior to employment there. Likewise when I left I was asked to assign to them all invention disclosures/patents that were filed or not filed while I was there.
 
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blycm
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Joined: July 3rd, 2012, 5:06 pm

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

June 22nd, 2013, 1:09 pm

Line item veto. Initial and date. Don't sign anything that 'owns' you. Double check everything you may be asked to sign while employed even things that are seemingly innocuous -- like say when you receive an HR manual. If you sign it is either binding, or enough to keep you in court long enough to serve the same purpose. Be aware that agreements signed after a period of employment can be more binding than the initial agreement. Don't think you can simply ignore the paper work, not sign and keep on working, that could be just as bad as signing. If you get asked to sign something nasty, you may need to prove you didn't sign or tacitly agree. I'm not an attorney, for legal advice hire a "Reassuringly Expensive Lawyer" and have them review anything - including that HR manual. Oh and keep a copy in a safe place.
Last edited by blycm on June 21st, 2013, 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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farmer
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Joined: December 16th, 2002, 7:09 am

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

June 22nd, 2013, 1:25 pm

Maybe that job just isn't for you. There are not massive numbers of inventive and energetic people. So anything that is done on a large scale is tuned to getting something useful out of lazy people with no initiative, at minimum risk. When you try to organize the activities of large numbers of people, it might be best to keep it simple, I wouldn't know.Can you blame companies for trying to buy low and sell high when it comes to people? It is the most efficient use of human meat. There are plenty of people who will take the job, and create value and be happy at the same time. Nobody needs you. So the simple answer is go ahead, fuck off if you like.
 
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iank
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Joined: October 7th, 2012, 7:45 pm

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

July 1st, 2013, 8:20 pm

A lot of this depends on the state.In California, non-compete clauses are unenforceable. If it were not for this, there would be no Silicon Valley (Fairchild Semiconductor begat National Semiconductor, Intel, etc...) Other states have different laws. Another question is what the compensation is for the non-compete. For example, do they pay you for the time that you don't work for someone else (a personal dream of mine).There is also case law that if you do the work outside of work, it's yours. The problem area is if it is very much like what your employers has you developing.I think that it is always a good idea to ask for all of the documents that you will be asked to sign before you accept the job and give notice.
 
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ArthurDent
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Joined: July 2nd, 2005, 4:38 pm

what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

July 2nd, 2013, 3:05 am

If you have ever tried getting a job at Bridgewater, you will know that they make you sign a 2 year non compete with no pay.It is not about whether they can enforce this. It is about whether they can sue you enough to make you unattractive as a candidate for your next job.If you develop some ideas when you are working, quit your job, stay unemployed for a plausible enough length of time that you can claim arm's length while developing the application, then start working on it full time.There is a reason it is called garden leave. The employer wants you to spend your time gardening.
 
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ArthurDent
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what's the point of working high-tech if they all make you sign restrictive covenants and the like?

July 2nd, 2013, 3:06 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: farmerMaybe that job just isn't for you. There are not massive numbers of inventive and energetic people. So anything that is done on a large scale is tuned to getting something useful out of lazy people with no initiative, at minimum risk. When you try to organize the activities of large numbers of people, it might be best to keep it simple, I wouldn't know.Can you blame companies for trying to buy low and sell high when it comes to people? It is the most efficient use of human meat. There are plenty of people who will take the job, and create value and be happy at the same time. Nobody needs you. So the simple answer is go ahead, fuck off if you like.Exactly.there are enough people who will sign up for non competes that companies don't care about the picky ones.Those creative types are likely more trouble anyway...