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neuroguy
Posts: 0
Joined: February 22nd, 2011, 4:07 pm

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 5th, 2014, 6:09 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: roundandround@quartz Thanks for chipping in. Yes, I think I want to start off with an ML Quant role and take it from there. I did not apply online to any specific positions - I just forwarded my CV to recruiters in those companies and told them what open positions I was interested in (almost all in Quant Research, not Dev, and a lot of them listed "Pattern Recognition", "Machine Learning", "Data Analytics" etc. as important skills to have). You do make an important point though - some shops could get turned off if they end up having to hire a guy who has no finance background in addition to not having written production quality code for a while. And regarding "finance exposure" - that's a good point too. I am slowly ramping up on that front. I have read some "pop articles" and several not-so-pop ones (mostly to get a sense of the Math that is being used). FWIW, I have also skimmed through some relevant titles (Hull, Wilmott, and Joshi). I do mention all this on my Resume. I am hoping that will count for something. I did think about hooking up with a Prof in the MBA dept who does this kind of of work, but I don't really have any bandwidth to start a full-fledged research project, given that graduation is near. @abc3 Thanks for writing. I think you are a bit off with the numbers though. Even with a terminal degree, you would be hard-pressed to cross 125k, unless you have multiple offers and negotiate hard - in which case you might be able to get to 135k, absolute max. Based on real data points. Of course there are outliers :-) @neuroguy Thanks. What kind of Math should I be worried about (other than Stochastic Calculus)? Mark Joshi's Quant Interviews book seems quite accessible...Sorry my choice of words was not very good. I don't think you should be 'worried'. What I meant was if you get an interview for a quant research rather than a quant development role then you are going to get a higher weight on the maths questions than the programming ones.So if you are putting yourself forward as an ML specialist then you better get your stats down well. Sometimes interviewers like to ask basic stats questions (for example concerning the Guassian, the multidimensional Guassian, OLS regression, convex optimisation, moments) because they can be worked out in situ and because it sorts out the people who put fancy stuff on their CVs but dont know basic maths from those who have a decent foundation.Programming wise, if you dont proffess to be a C++ wizard, you wont get those questions. But you will get questions about algorithms (for which I recommend Cormen) and possibly about system design/architecture. Again, that is sort those out who know high level languages as 'scripting languages' from those who actually know something about software development and programming. However I agree with the sentiment here that your CV probably sucks or mis-markets you if you have not had any interviews. If you want me to take a look at it, send me a PM.
 
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traderjoe1976
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Joined: May 19th, 2006, 9:50 am

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 6th, 2014, 3:17 pm

Well, at Google / Facebook / Microsoft / Oracle, you will get starting salary between $160 K - $180 K. Also you will get a lot of respect for your technical skills.Plus, after five years, your salary will be more than $300 K.You may get higher salary of Wall Street. However, if the trader's system is down for 15 minutes, as far as he is concerned your PhD degree has the same value as toilet paper and he will be in your face yelling at you and telling you that you are a "frigging moron" and a "worthless POS". If you are prepared for that kind of treatment, welcome to Wall Street.
 
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roundandround
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Joined: November 18th, 2011, 8:19 pm

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 7th, 2014, 6:17 am

@neuroguy This side of the Atlantic, "worried" means something else :-) Yes, I got the Stats and the Algos part well covered. Thanks also for the offer to review my CV. It is being reviewed by some alumni from my school (who are in the Quant world) as we speak. I will post the feedback here.@traderjoe1976 Would you mind sharing your sources for the numbers you mention? 300k etc. in 5yrs is exception at Google/Facebook/Microsoft, not a norm, reserved for just a handful of people doing the right things at the right group - I guarantee you that. 5yrs after joining with a fresh PhD, you would probably be making 175k+stocks at Google/Facebook (and significantly lesser at Microsoft, unless you are at Microsoft Research) if you are really smart and productive. Most Silicon Valley bigwigs are notoriously bad at sharing profits and giving pay hikes. Not too sure about the "respect" part either - it is no fun being pushed around by a 21yr old Program/Product "Manager" on a daily basis. But yes, you probably get a bit more respect and less abuse in the tech world.
 
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neuroguy
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Joined: February 22nd, 2011, 4:07 pm

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 7th, 2014, 6:43 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: roundandround@neuroguy This side of the Atlantic, "worried" means something else :-) Yes, I got the Stats and the Algos part well covered. Thanks also for the offer to review my CV. It is being reviewed by some alumni from my school (who are in the Quant world) as we speak. I will post the feedback here.@traderjoe1976 Would you mind sharing your sources for the numbers you mention? 300k etc. in 5yrs is exception at Google/Facebook/Microsoft, not a norm, reserved for just a handful of people doing the right things at the right group - I guarantee you that. 5yrs after joining with a fresh PhD, you would probably be making 175k+stocks at Google/Facebook (and significantly lesser at Microsoft, unless you are at Microsoft Research) if you are really smart and productive. Most Silicon Valley bigwigs are notoriously bad at sharing profits and giving pay hikes. Not too sure about the "respect" part either - it is no fun being pushed around by a 21yr old Program/Product "Manager" on a daily basis. But yes, you probably get a bit more respect and less abuse in the tech world.I agree. I know a couple of people at Google (developers) and I think the pay and 'fun' of the job is rather exageratted.However traderjoe is right that in finance it helps to be a masochist. And you definately find yourself in surreal situations with people who dont really know much about technology having wildly unrealistic expectations.
 
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lexington
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Joined: November 16th, 2008, 5:04 am

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 8th, 2014, 9:43 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: traderjoe1976Well, at Google / Facebook / Microsoft / Oracle, you will get starting salary between $160 K - $180 K. Also you will get a lot of respect for your technical skills.Plus, after five years, your salary will be more than $300 K.You may get higher salary of Wall Street. However, if the trader's system is down for 15 minutes, as far as he is concerned your PhD degree has the same value as toilet paper and he will be in your face yelling at you and telling you that you are a "frigging moron" and a "worthless POS". If you are prepared for that kind of treatment, welcome to Wall Street.Wall Street is better than tech companies. Watch this video to see what happens in tech companies.IT boss in abuse video charged with hurting and abusing employee
 
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Cuchulainn
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Joined: July 16th, 2004, 7:38 am
Location: 20, 000

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 8th, 2014, 12:47 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: lexingtonQuoteOriginally posted by: traderjoe1976Well, at Google / Facebook / Microsoft / Oracle, you will get starting salary between $160 K - $180 K. Also you will get a lot of respect for your technical skills.Plus, after five years, your salary will be more than $300 K.You may get higher salary of Wall Street. However, if the trader's system is down for 15 minutes, as far as he is concerned your PhD degree has the same value as toilet paper and he will be in your face yelling at you and telling you that you are a "frigging moron" and a "worthless POS". If you are prepared for that kind of treatment, welcome to Wall Street.Wall Street is better than tech companies. Watch this video to see what happens in tech companies.IT boss in abuse video charged with hurting and abusing employeeLooks like my Latin teacher at school So, slapping is restricted to IT companies?
Last edited by Cuchulainn on March 7th, 2014, 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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katastrofa
Posts: 7440
Joined: August 16th, 2007, 5:36 am
Location: Alpha Centauri

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 10th, 2014, 9:24 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: roundandround@neuroguy This side of the Atlantic, "worried" means something else :-) Yes, I got the Stats and the Algos part well covered. Thanks also for the offer to review my CV. It is being reviewed by some alumni from my school (who are in the Quant world) as we speak. I will post the feedback here.@traderjoe1976 Would you mind sharing your sources for the numbers you mention? 300k etc. in 5yrs is exception at Google/Facebook/Microsoft, not a norm, reserved for just a handful of people doing the right things at the right group - I guarantee you that. 5yrs after joining with a fresh PhD, you would probably be making 175k+stocks at Google/Facebook (and significantly lesser at Microsoft, unless you are at Microsoft Research) if you are really smart and productive. Most Silicon Valley bigwigs are notoriously bad at sharing profits and giving pay hikes. Not too sure about the "respect" part either - it is no fun being pushed around by a 21yr old Program/Product "Manager" on a daily basis. But yes, you probably get a bit more respect and less abuse in the tech world.As far as I know, Wall Street firms did not form an agreement not to hire IT people from each other the way some major Silicon Valley firms did.
 
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DevonFangs
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Joined: November 9th, 2009, 1:49 pm

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 10th, 2014, 4:05 pm

QuoteOriginally posted by: traderjoe1976You may get higher salary of Wall Street. However, if the trader's system is down for 15 minutes, as far as he is concerned your PhD degree has the same value as toilet paper and he will be in your face yelling at you and telling you that you are a "frigging moron" and a "worthless POS". If you are prepared for that kind of treatment, welcome to Wall Street.To be fair, the people I've seen mistreating other humans most badly are senior quants, rather than traders. Because they are so smart they can do whatever they want, yeah.
 
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katastrofa
Posts: 7440
Joined: August 16th, 2007, 5:36 am
Location: Alpha Centauri

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 10th, 2014, 10:55 pm

I concur. Quants can have this white-collar viciousness. Traders (at least in IBs) are more like highly-paid blue-collar workers, hence both more impulsive but also more easy-going.
Last edited by katastrofa on March 9th, 2014, 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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bearish
Posts: 5186
Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Graduating with a CS PHD soon. Have not got a single quant interview !

March 11th, 2014, 1:41 am

QuoteOriginally posted by: katastrofaI concur. Quants can have this white-collar viciousness. Traders (at least in IBs) are more like highly-paid blue-collar workers, hence both more impulsive but also more easy-going.You mean rather than being told that you are a POS a**hole, you are informed that your so-called martingale is only a local martingale?