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bearish
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Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Re: VAT

August 28th, 2021, 12:56 am

I totally agree with that. Obviously, you have a large common market with a common currency, language and a (mostly) uniform commercial code, but you do kind of bet your (and your family’s) health on making it. No wonder there are more “self-made” (silly phrase, I know) billionaires per capita in Norway than in the US.
 
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bearish
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Re: VAT

August 28th, 2021, 1:00 am

Although, in all fairness, having recently been through some horrendous health problems myself, I can provide supporting testimony to the idea that the US has the best health care in the world, as long as you live in the right place and have the right insurance. Which is a very important part of the reason it will be so hard to fix the broken system.
 
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Paul
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Joined: July 20th, 2001, 3:28 pm

Re: VAT

August 28th, 2021, 1:12 am

Oh, I agree, if seriously ill, with insurance and in a hurry the US is the best. But anything less than the best insurance and you'll be bombarded with inexplicable bills for all of eternity. Every person in US healthcare seems to have their own online payment portal, so a minor checkup and you'll have to have a dozen new logins. If you don't like paperwork you'll end up wishing you were dead. 
 
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Paul
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Re: VAT

October 1st, 2021, 6:07 pm

I'm never going to stop saying it, VAT is stupid. 

And so is HMRC. When you complete your VAT return you get a form in which it says:

"Net VAT to pay to HMRC or reclaim (this is the difference between box 3 and 4)"

It doesn't say whether you have to pay or will be repaid. There is no sign in front of the number. How hard would it be to tell you? Clearly the accountants at HMRC do not appreciate the importance of signs, you know, like when managing cash flow.  
 
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Cuchulainn
Posts: 17491
Joined: July 16th, 2004, 7:38 am
Location: Lviv

Re: VAT

July 30th, 2022, 2:53 pm

not exactly  VAT  but it's a start

If you spend more than £390 in shops elsewhere in Europe this summer, get ready to pay customs duties and VAT on your return – which can easily add 20% or more to the price paid.

Navigating the rules is not easy. You have to declare where the item was made as well as where it was bought. That €500 item of adult clothing bought in Spain comes with a £99 charge if it was made outside the EU but £86.08 if made inside.

If you live in Northern Ireland, then it’s a completely different story, with the province treated as if it is inside the EU for customs purposes. That means the tax on an item of adult clothing bought in Barcelona and taken home to Belfast is zero.
planetoid 17300 == 2002 AV_63
 
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bearish
Posts: 4825
Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 1:39 am

not exactly  VAT  but it's a start

If you spend more than £390 in shops elsewhere in Europe this summer, get ready to pay customs duties and VAT on your return – which can easily add 20% or more to the price paid.

Navigating the rules is not easy. You have to declare where the item was made as well as where it was bought. That €500 item of adult clothing bought in Spain comes with a £99 charge if it was made outside the EU but £86.08 if made inside.

If you live in Northern Ireland, then it’s a completely different story, with the province treated as if it is inside the EU for customs purposes. That means the tax on an item of adult clothing bought in Barcelona and taken home to Belfast is zero.
Those of us with a smattering of finance training will spot an arb here. But I trust that the good people of NI will not stoop to the level of making personal profit by exploiting foundational cracks in the wonders of Brexit.
 
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Paul
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Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 8:14 am

It’s probably a significantly limited arbitrage. Once you hit a certain turnover you might have to register for VAT at which point the arb disappears and you simply get embroiled in VAT (invented by continentals) paperwork.
 
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Paul
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Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 8:27 am

In practice it’s completely different. In my experience when you make a declaration to the very nice and reasonable British customs person they say, “Nah, it’s alright, mate.” If the goods cost a significant amount then they say, “How many people in your party? Including children, stuffed animals, cremated remains, etc.?” You answer and they say, “You’re alright then, it’s one allowance each.”

But don’t let me stop you. As I’ve said, it’s the Age of Hysteria after all.
 
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Cuchulainn
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Location: Lviv

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 1:01 pm

A few hundred yards down the road at Jonesborough they are a bit borderline.

https://www.irishtimes.com/health/2022/ ... p-to-3000/

And you can pay in Euros or Sterling.

Where there's a will there's a way. I did warn you.
planetoid 17300 == 2002 AV_63
 
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Cuchulainn
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Location: Lviv

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 1:12 pm

Use Cases

1. Goods v service
2. UK -> EU
3. EU -> UK
planetoid 17300 == 2002 AV_63
 
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Cuchulainn
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Location: Lviv

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 1:15 pm

It’s probably a significantly limited arbitrage. Once you hit a certain turnover you might have to register for VAT at which point the arb disappears and you simply get embroiled in VAT (invented by continentals) paperwork.
+ an American.
It was a yuge milestone in the 20th century

The value-added tax (VAT) is a relatively new tax. It was designed by two people, independently, in the early 20th century. To Wilhelm Von Siemens, a German businessman, the VAT was a way to resolve the cascading problems that arose in implementing gross turnover taxes and sales taxes. To Thomas S. Adams, an American, the VAT was a better version of the corporate income tax.
In practice, governments have implemented the VAT largely as an improved sales tax. European countries, for example, have largely used the VAT to reduce or eliminate other sales taxes. The countries continue to maintain separate corporate income taxes.
Many European countries enacted a VAT in the 1960s and 1970s. Other countries followed in the 1980s and thereafter. Sijbren Cnossen, a leading VAT expert from Maastricht University in the Netherlands, called its spread “the most important event in the evolution of tax structure in the last half of the 20th century” (1998, 399).
planetoid 17300 == 2002 AV_63
 
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Cuchulainn
Posts: 17491
Joined: July 16th, 2004, 7:38 am
Location: Lviv

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 1:56 pm

In practice it’s completely different. In my experience when you make a declaration to the very nice and reasonable British customs person they say, “Nah, it’s alright, mate.” If the goods cost a significant amount then they say, “How many people in your party? Including children, stuffed animals, cremated remains, etc.?” You answer and they say, “You’re alright then, it’s one allowance each.”

But don’t let me stop you. As I’ve said, it’s the Age of Hysteria after all.
In Australia, they'd give you a 4-year prison sentence for that carry on.
planetoid 17300 == 2002 AV_63
 
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DavidJN
Posts: 181
Joined: July 14th, 2002, 3:00 am

Re: VAT

July 31st, 2022, 6:50 pm

The VAT in essence works as follows. Someone digs a hole and walks away. Someone else comes, fills in the hole, then digs a bigger hole and walks away, and so on. The hole gets a little larger every time. The billions of debits and credits and thus generated daily are the accountant’s and the bureaucrat’s wet dream. It is a practical foundation for the modern surveillance society. You are what you spend!