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bearish
Posts: 5691
Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

Well, technically it’s Arkansas, but thats a subtle difference. I’ll blame the spell checker.

bearish
Posts: 5691
Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

So Rand Paul is holding up a bi-partisan bill against lynching black people because, well you know... If you’re from Kentucky, you have to choose your stance carefully.

katastrofa
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

OK, guys -- here's a link to the Mac Donald piece that will be valid for a few days -- fair use, IMO. I am genuinely interested in intelligent objections to it.
It needs a rewrite. It's all over the place and misleading.

It seems to be saying in the santy clause (last paragraph) that it's all Obama's fault.

My take is that, in the end, what Obama said and what Trump said are a sideshow. The main point of the opinion piece is "(The) share of black (fatal shooting) victims is less than what the black crime rate would predict, since police shootings are a function of how often officers encounter armed and violent suspects". My gut feel is that's probably true. I also think you can reach that conclusion without being a 'sneaky racist'. Finally, I agree with Mac Donald's concluding remark: "The Minneapolis officers who arrested George Floyd must be held accountable for their excessive use of force and callous indifference to his distress. Police training needs to double down on de-escalation tactics. But Floyd's death should not undermine the legitimacy of American law enforcement, without which we will continue on a path toward chaos."
Statistics is better than lies because it can mould data into whatever conclusion you want. For me the author lost credibility when quoting the false results. The more so I'm not buying the above unfounded musings. "less than what the black crime rate would predict" - I would actually check this if I could find such data.

Alan
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

OK, go for it.

Here's the Washington Post db of fatal police shootings since 2015, which was mentioned in the articles.
Here's a link to FBI crime arrest statistics, a sample guide, a sample table (which has ethnicity data).. There should be similar data for other years.

Cuchulainn
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

An actual, and closely related, mystery is how the NYT decided to publish a highly inflammatory note this week by Tom Cotton (ultra right-wing asshole and junior senator from Armpit). He called for sending in the army and blasting away the protesters and looters. In the physical paper it's obvious that it is in fact an op-ed piece, but since most people read their news in virtualized form, many just took it to be another NYT article and were confused. NYT journalists and staffers were not amused. It might have felt like a good idea at the time, but giving the enemy a platform in the name of free speech and informed debate is a dicey venture.
I looked him, up for curiosity. Ticks most of the boxes I would say.

In June 2020, amid protests over the death of George Floyd, Cotton advocated on Twitter that the military be used to support police, and to give "No quarter for insurrectionists, anarchists, rioters, and looters."[71][72] In the military, the term "no quarter" refers to the killing of lawfully surrendering combatants, which is a war crime under the Geneva Convention. Cotton subsequently said that he was using the “colloquial” version of the phrase and cited examples of Democrats and the mainstream media also using the phrase.[73][74] Cotton later authored New York Times editorial titled "Send In the Troops" where he argued for the deployment of federal troops into major American cities. Dozens of New York Times staff members sharply criticized the decision to the publish Cotton's article, describing its rhetoric as dangerous.[75][76] Following the uproar from staffers, The New York Times responded by saying the piece went through a "rushed editorial process" that will now be examined.[77]

He is NRA A-rated student.

Again, NYT make another  faux pas.
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Cuchulainn
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

Tom Cotton also recommended restricting Chinese students to studying Humanities and not science etc. Not a clever move; where will you find C++ developers and math-savvy students?(?)

Some 'countries' like C++, some don't.
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katastrofa
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

OK, go for it.

Here's the Washington Post db of fatal police shootings since 2015, which was mentioned in the articles.
Here's a link to FBI crime arrest statistics, a sample guide, a sample table (which has ethnicity data).. There should be similar data for other years.
Obviously it requires going much deeper into the data, but probably speaks more than a white middle-class man's guts xx
1) the police killed 370 whites and 235 black in 2019 (similar numbers in previous years - source: WP data)
2) according to the FBI data whites commit 69% crimes and blacks only 27% (I'm looking at totals - after all, Floyd died because he was suspected of using a false $20). Someone should look at the discrimination of the hispanic and "unknown" (I guess I would fall into that category), but it shouldn't be used to deny the discrimination against the black. bearish Posts: 5691 Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm Re: Trump -- the last 100 days Tom Cotton also recommended restricting Chinese students to studying Humanities and not science etc. Not a clever move; where will you find C++ developers and math-savvy students?(?) Of course, we could ask the same question about the UK. Some 'countries' like C++, some don't. I did not expect C++ to make its way into the Trump thread! I would say that the primary downside to banning (full pay) Chinese students from the US is the resulting university defunding, which in the first instance would hit STEM departments. This may indeed be a welcome side effect as far as the GOP is concerned. bearish Posts: 5691 Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm Re: Trump -- the last 100 days “Hopefully, George is looking down right now and saying, ‘This is a great thing happening for our country,” Trump said of Floyd, who was killed in police custody last week. “A great day for him, a great day for everybody. This is great day for everybody.” Cuchulainn Posts: 62602 Joined: July 16th, 2004, 7:38 am Location: Amsterdam Contact: Re: Trump -- the last 100 days Meanwhile, up in Buffalo.. www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSPx0zuUktY Law and order in action. Step over the gap, not into it. Watch the space between platform and train. http://www.datasimfinancial.com http://www.datasim.nl Cuchulainn Posts: 62602 Joined: July 16th, 2004, 7:38 am Location: Amsterdam Contact: Re: Trump -- the last 100 days Tom Cotton also recommended restricting Chinese students to studying Humanities and not science etc. Not a clever move; where will you find C++ developers and math-savvy students?(?) Of course, we could ask the same question about the UK. Some 'countries' like C++, some don't. I did not expect C++ to make its way into the Trump thread! I would say that the primary downside to banning (full pay) Chinese students from the US is the resulting university defunding, which in the first instance would hit STEM departments. This may indeed be a welcome side effect as far as the GOP is concerned. Quants must learn C++. Step over the gap, not into it. Watch the space between platform and train. http://www.datasimfinancial.com http://www.datasim.nl bearish Posts: 5691 Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm Re: Trump -- the last 100 days Ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem esse delendam! Alan Topic Author Posts: 10267 Joined: December 19th, 2001, 4:01 am Location: California Contact: Re: Trump -- the last 100 days OK, go for it. Here's the Washington Post db of fatal police shootings since 2015, which was mentioned in the articles. Here's a link to FBI crime arrest statistics, a sample guide, a sample table (which has ethnicity data).. There should be similar data for other years. Obviously it requires going much deeper into the data, but probably speaks more than a white middle-class man's guts xx 1) the police killed 370 whites and 235 black in 2019 (similar numbers in previous years - source: WP data) 2) according to the FBI data whites commit 69% crimes and blacks only 27% (I'm looking at totals - after all, Floyd died because he was suspected of using a false$20).
Someone should look at the discrimination of the hispanic and "unknown" (I guess I would fall into that category), but it shouldn't be used to deny the discrimination against the black.

At best, you've proven your point that "Statistics is better than lies because it can mould data into whatever conclusion you want".

First of, at the link you cited, you had the choice to pick from 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020 (partial), or the total. You selected 2019, which just happens to be the most favorable for your case. Next, given the chance to use data on murder or other violent crime arrests (the ones obviously most likely to involve a fatal shooting), you instead decide to use "all crimes". Because, after all,  Floyd died because he was suspected of using a false \$20.

Last edited by Alan on June 5th, 2020, 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

trackstar
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Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

Meanwhile, up in Buffalo..

Law and order in action.
I am saddened by the violence on both sides - but this situation with the 79-year old man is extreme.  He was actually trying to hand a police helmet back to the officers and when pushed roughly and fell backward, he hit his head on the pavement so hard that he was knocked unconscious and blood came out profusely from the back of his head.

I looked for news on how he was doing and could only find that he was listed as being "stable" in a hospital in the area.

With bricks flying, glass breaking, rubber bullets, and tear gas, a lot of people have been injured in recent days. I don't want to say more about any of this here, but it is heavy and everyone I have spoken to in my community is thinking about it. Protests are one form of action, but private, consistent, positive actions have a role in society too.

bearish
Posts: 5691
Joined: February 3rd, 2011, 2:19 pm

Re: Trump -- the last 100 days

According to the Buffalo newspaper he was in a “stable but serious” condition. So the entire emergency response team has quit their ERT assignments (but not their jobs) in protest against the suspension of the two police officers carrying out the assault. A reasonable next step would be to fire them all, but that won’t actually be all that easy. Unions are a somewhat mixed blessing, police unions even more so.