damn!QuoteHedge fund Vega loses big in JuneInterest rate woes, redemptions spell more than $600 million in losses for Vega.July 13, 2005: 2:38 PM EDTBy Amanda Cantrell, CNN/Money staff writerNEW YORK (CNN/Money) - Vega Asset Management, one of the largest hedge funds in the world, told investors that its funds' assets decreased more than $600 million in the month of June because of investor redemptions and portfolio losses. The firm noted that its assets have fallen to $6.7 billion, from a peak of $10.4 billion last year.People familiar with Vega said the firm has struggled in the current interest rate environment, with long-term interest rates failing to rise as quickly as short-term rates, a scenario Alan Greenspan has called a "conundrum.""The current drawdowns across the Vega Funds are unprecedented in the more than eight and a half years since we launched the first fund," wrote Jonathan Berg, the chief executive of Vega Asset Management (USA) LLC, the firm's New York division, in a letter to investors.Berg said the firm's negative performance, continued from April and May, had to do with sharp moves in the global fixed income markets during the first week of June after weaker than expected U.S. employment data as well as the firm's moves to systematically unwind positions during the rest of the month in accordance with the firm's risk management policy.Berg wrote that the firm has made moves to streamline its portfolios and has appointed Rajiv Sobti, head trader in its New York office, to co-manage its Relative Value fund. Sobti joined Vega last year from BlackRock, where he had served as co-head of fixed income."Vega has taken aggressive measures to preserve capital and generate profits, including reducing risk; reallocating capital to trading teams that show consistent positive performance; and investing in our infrastructure to keep improving our business platform," read a statement from the firm. "It is important to note that Vega's commitment to our investment strategies and our strict adherence to our funds' risk limits have enabled us to successfully rebound from similar experiences in the past."Founded in 1996 by former Citibank and Banco Santander trader Ravi Mehra, the fund follows a global macro trading strategy, in which managers seek to anticipate and profit from broad trends in the global economy. Macro managers trade stocks, bonds, currencies and equities and are known for having more portfolio volatility than those following more traditional trading strategies.Some industry watchers have speculated that at $10.4 billion, the firm may have gotten too large, but others say the highly liquid fund is experiencing some performance difficulties at a time when investors have been quicker than usual to yank their money out of flagging funds. Blame it on quants, fire a bunch and call it a day.

Much ado about nothing, as usual.I happen to be acquainted with one of the head traders at Vega - far cry from the real story behind the scene. Who are really the people familiar with Vega? I wish Amanda Cantrell could tell us. And in the meantime Mike, pls peddle your lies elsewhere!

Mike,QuotePeople familiar with Vega said the firm has struggled in the current interest rate environment, with long-term interest rates failing to rise as quickly as short-term rates, a scenario Alan Greenspan has called a "conundrum."could you elaborate on the difficulties this raises?

QuoteOriginally posted by: bashirfMuch ado about nothing, as usual.I happen to be acquainted with one of the head traders at Vega - far cry from the real story behind the scene. Who are really the people familiar with Vega? I wish Amanda Cantrell could tell us. And in the meantime Mike, pls peddle your lies elsewhere!What lies, you dumbass?

QuoteOriginally posted by: brontosaurusMike,QuotePeople familiar with Vega said the firm has struggled in the current interest rate environment, with long-term interest rates failing to rise as quickly as short-term rates, a scenario Alan Greenspan has called a "conundrum."could you elaborate on the difficulties this raises?I'm not familiar with Vega but think about it for a sec... what kind of strategy could they be using?

QuoteOriginally posted by: mikebellWhat lies, you dumbass?So you're the goodie MikeBell and I'm the baddie who should prove you wrong, right?Okay let's review the mean and aims of a troll as you pointed out so well in the earlier post. Techniques of Trolls1. Flooding by excessive posting:BashirF - 89 posts so far. MikeBell 1702 posts!!!2. Attacking regulars in a group How many regulars have you attacked and assulted so far? Let me see: TJ, N, BashirF, Marsden, AlexandreC.... not to mention those who are no longer posting for some obvious reasons (the list is too long - something like 20-30 regulars)3. Attempting to divide and conquerMany shrewd posters in quantitative finance are no longer posting here - many thanks to you!!!4. Trying to impress others with their knowledgeIt would help if I use your own words: Harvard was very happy with me. My patrons were extremely happy with my performance. I busted my ass in HS, won many academic competitions, bested everyone around me and rightfully deserved it Me? I only have a b from Springfield Community College 5. Spreading rumorsAlways state news items that usually turn out to be wrong due to lack of understanding - Just remember Do not state opinions as facts. That's called lying. (Do I need to remind you who said it?)So in a nutshell, anyone can say without a doubt that MikeBell is the real troll around here who spins yarns which excessively inflate the signal to noise ratio - pretty disgusting, aweeeeh.

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Ok, I am actually with Bashirf in that 600mn figure is probably far from the truth. I can live with the number being around 100mn in one month. So lets work out some details:10.4bn fund, lets say their risk capital is 80% (this is probably more aggressive since I don't think they leverage that much). They are a global macro fund but lets just say that they lost the most in the US market in June. Lets also look at some popular hedge fund trades during that month on the US curve. regular butterflies, conditional flies, conditional steepeners, long end steepeners, and some condors. The worst carry would probably be the steepener trades which might be a key indicator of their position (since they want the long rates to be higher). On 8.32bn of risk capital, the monthly carry would have to be -72bps to loss 600mn in one month since the June month was rather flat. The biggest mark down was probably the 10yr UST going to 3.9. Last I checked, there is simply no way that you can have a negative carry that horrendous during one month in trade even if you start trading some crazy swaps with 8 legs.Ok so this is all assuming that they were not punting the long end. So here are my assumptions: big fund, good risk control, they are relatively low vol with high returns before, all meaning they try to hedge and have decent risk control. If however, they did punt the long end in June, then there MIGHT be a chance they lost money. However, I heard nothing on the street that they were punting but did hear rumors of them unwinding their steepener trades. So based on my assumption, that 600mn figure just seems ridiculous.Disclaimer: No I do not work for this place.

Who left because of me??? LOL... QuoteOriginally posted by: bashirf5. Spreading rumorsAlways state news items that usually turn out to be wrong due to lack of understanding - Just remember Do not state opinions as facts. That's called lying. (Do I need to remind you who said it?)Go bitch to CNN who reported this story. Fair warning - continue this character attack and I will sue you. You can debate me and argue with me for as long as you want but I draw the line when someone calls me a liar. I will give you a chance to prove that and back up your statement(s) in court. I will find out who you are (your identity is only a quick subpoena away) and I will pay as much money as needed to make sure your legal bills start piling up. Make no mistake, I do what I say. So, continue and start making it even worse for yourself. I will just bump up the damages. I am using my real name on this site and you're posting under pseudonyms and hiding behind screenanmes. I'm now going to save all these wonderful claims against me.

I'd love to be sued.

QuoteOriginally posted by: mikebellFair warning - continue this character attack and I will sue you. Depends if he/she is in a jurisdiction which has anti-libel laws.

Techniques of Trolls (Continue...):6. Threatening PeopleQuoteOriginally posted by: mikebellFair warning - continue this character attack and I will sue you. You can debate me and argue with me for as long as you want but I draw the line when someone calls me a liar. I will give you a chance to prove that and back up your statement(s) in court. I will find out who you are (your identity is only a quick subpoena away) and I will pay as much money as needed to make sure your legal bills start piling up. Make no mistake, I do what I say. So, continue and start making it even worse for yourself. I will just bump up the damages. I am using my real name on this site and you're posting under pseudonyms and hiding behind screenanmes. I'm now going to save all these wonderful claims against me.Do you see what I mean? Btw, you should be suing farmer as well for the following claim: Oh, and to Mikebell in the meantime, you are an evil liar and deceiver! Liar! Death to the liar!!!Everyone is equal before the law, right? Once again, do not state opinions as facts. That's another form of lying. You're welcome to express your ideas as you see them, but do not quote from the gutter press. Or to put it in another way, do you really think we can debate with Amanda Cantrell about her findings concerning Vega? No we can't! Either way, MikeBell's threat is taken lightly and I will be willing to battle him whether in court or in the ring at the Summer Slam with zeal. Best advice for Mike - Find another forum to troll around.

am sure the 600mm figure is massaged and misquoted - but then what do you expect from a nonspecial news agency's story on a financial matter...i don't see why this misreporting worries you so much bashirf? fof and investors will see the performance themselves so what is there to worry about?surely you don't believe everything you read?on a similar note look at glg's performance and their 'everythings fine' comment..at the end of the day - sack the quant and pay management - the cure to the worlds ills

I think the people we should really look at suing are the Rupert Murdochs and Ted Turners of this world. Allowing their media to publish shit like this, factually incorrect, no accountability etc etc. Like most evil tyrants they want us to be fighting each other .