Dear all,I am exploring opportunties for relocation to HK/Tokyo or possible Singapore. I was previously based with a bank in Tokyo in 2001 and at that time they gave fairly generous housing allowances. I am interested to know what is the situation now? It seems to me a bit of poker match in as much the banks need to recruit people there and if you dont ask for anything they wont give you a housing allowance but what is the norm for a VP/Director level position (married)? I know when I was last there there was a vast discrepency depending largely on peoples negotiating skills, being a quant I always seems to be not so good in this department. So dont feel very confident trying to negotiate a relocation local market knowledge? Thanks in advance for your help

well I have a friend who relocated there from the US, he got a very nice apartment for 2 months with his wife and it was for an associate level with a very small bank...

Korbabe - my comments are more relevant for HK & Singapore than Tokyo.You are right in that a few years ago it was fairly common for ex pat employees to get housing allowances, and not totally uncommon for local hires. In recent years a lot of places have been cutting back on these, but as you observed it can sometimes come down to your (or your HH's) negotiating skills. A key factor is how badly the firm needs to hire you, and then secondly if there is a competing offer on the table. At VP / Director level it's likely that you would be in the category of being able to offer any potential employer a proven track record thus increasing your negotiation power. Certainly if you don't ask you are unlikely to get.What is reasonable to ask for is a completely different ball game. I know director level exotics traders with non top tier US banks who have been given circa $70k USD per annum for housing, associate level structurers with good European banks who have been given $30k USD per annum, and VP level quants with top tier European banks who have been given $50k USD. These are all in HK. For Tokyo if anything you could reasonably expect more, in Singapore probably a bit less (reflecting that rents in Singapore have dramatically risen in the last 18 months). Hopefully this gives you a few data points, if you want me to try and give a more specific assessment then fee free to PM me.

I'd agree with the numbers stated for HK, for Tokyo the numbers were similar ( or even better) one and half years back. You'll have to keep in mind that HK has moved ahead of Tokyo in past two years though. Housing as part of the package used to be a norm earlier, which is less likely now. There will be exceptions no doubt given where are you joining, job criticality etc. etc.

QuoteOriginally posted by: razrYou'll have to keep in mind that HK has moved ahead of Tokyo in past two years though.Why is that? Is it because the general perception has swung in favor of HK as a more active/developed financial center than Tokyo? (I'm thinking of the Global Financial Centers Index)

In general every other firm is making more money there ( certainly for equity and some on FX and credits). Other reason could be the tax structure - which is far more attractive than Japan. Few years back, equity and rates business for most of the firms used to be driven out of Tokyo, starting mid last year they have started moving to HK.

That's interesting...When comparing between HK and Singapore for one of the big European banks, it looks evenly split for FX and interest rate derivatives... However, it looks like HK has the lead in equity and credit derivatives?

QuoteOriginally posted by: NShahWhat is reasonable to ask for is a completely different ball game. I know director level exotics traders with non top tier US banks who have been given circa $70k USD per annum for housing, associate level structurers with good European banks who have been given $30k USD per annum, and VP level quants with top tier European banks who have been given $50k USD. These are all in HK. .I dunno about the non top tier banks, but otherwise, your numbers are way off. Unless you're talking about back office, the front office salaries are pretty much the same as US / London.

QuoteOriginally posted by: neoscientQuoteOriginally posted by: NShahWhat is reasonable to ask for is a completely different ball game. I know director level exotics traders with non top tier US banks who have been given circa $70k USD per annum for housing, associate level structurers with good European banks who have been given $30k USD per annum, and VP level quants with top tier European banks who have been given $50k USD. These are all in HK. .I dunno about the non top tier banks, but otherwise, your numbers are way off. Unless you're talking about back office, the front office salaries are pretty much the same as US / London.We are talking specifically about housing allowances ONLY. There is no mention whatsoever about salaries. The numbers I have given are real data points for housing allowances.Awaiting your apology as soon as you have read the thread properly

QuoteOriginally posted by: NShahQuoteOriginally posted by: neoscientQuoteOriginally posted by: NShahAwaiting your apology as soon as you have read the thread properly ;-)righto. haha sorry about that, was a long day