quantmeh, who's talking about africa here?if you would like to create a new thread about donations, the best way to help people in need etc thats absolutely fine, but this is not the topic being discussed here. If i extended your reasoning i could tell you to be grateful for being alive and stop the discussion?

QuoteOriginally posted by: ceticoquantmeh, who's talking about africa here?if you would like to create a new thread about donations, the best way to help people in need etc thats absolutely fine, but this is not the topic being discussed here. If i extended your reasoning i could tell you to be grateful for being alive and stop the discussion?Don't take him(her?) seriously. He(she?) likes to needle people every once in a while. Enjoy and relax. Life (career) is too short . As you can see I am unsure about his (her?) sex. Some of his (her?) comments hinted he was a she. He (she?) even offered to be on the front page of playboy once if the money was right. Who want to see a dude in Playboy. Damn!!- the doubt never leaves me. Quantmeh can you clear it for me!!

QuoteOriginally posted by: GamalQuoteOriginally posted by: Jim> actually, i think it's quite common in bad times to offer promotion with low/no bonus or salary increase as a kind of compensation. Indeed. Many of you are too young to remember the late '80's and early '90's when banks lost a lot of money on Brazil and other Latin American debt. When they couldn't afford bonuses the banks gave out titles instead. Soon everyone was a VP or Managing Director, but not getting paid any differently. One thing which did come with the new title was more days of vacation. The new title made the CV look good, but everyone on the Street knew an MD from bank XYZ really meant 'Monetarily Deprived'.The other reason is that VP or MD looks much better on your business card when you meet clients and they feel more important.not to say how it looks when it comes to pick up girls

QuoteOriginally posted by: capafan2Some of his (her?) comments hinted he was a she.never thought about it

QuoteOriginally posted by: quantmehQuoteOriginally posted by: ceticoIs it acceptable (by law), to be offered a promotion without a pay rise, what are your rights?Russian would say about you "С жиру бесится"take your promotion and be grateful, it's not like you're helping starving famine victims in Africa.ok. that sounds cool and all that, but would you do what you suggest yourself i.e. take a promotion and be grateful? i'm almost sure the first thing you'll do is update your CV and start the ball rolling....zero salary increase while being promoted not only means underpaid for the new corporate title, it also means worse off for the next year, thanks to inflation.

QuoteOriginally posted by: ceticoIf i extended your reasoning i could tell you to be grateful for being alive and stop the discussion?you don't get it that it's not all about money, especially in current environment. promotions bring other benefits beyond salary, some monetary some not. e.g. number of vacation days, bonuses, information etc. you also get one step closer to the coveted MD title. the information part is huge. you have no idea how much more information you start receiving when you get higher up the ladder. that's why you're being ungrateful. i'd fire you

QuoteOriginally posted by: ThinkDifferentwould you do what you suggest yourself i.e. take a promotion and be grateful?perhaps. it depends on what else comes with a title.think of this: what if someone asks you be a team lead without getting pay hike? it's an opportunity to have more influence, things will go your way more often, which may mean (if you're smarter than others) that things will be better, more money earned, higher bonuses for everyone.

,@quantmeh i on the other hand, would hire hou to work for me, giving you a promotion without a pay rise, keeping my cost base constant with increased pressure and responsibility for you...we're both happy!

Cetico,You may not like how QuantMeh says it but there is a lot of truth in it. I suspect you are either very well treated by your boss (although taken for granted when it comes to money). It will help to take the promotion and bid some time. You will be able to claim bigger things on your resume which will help you when you make the switch. The information aspect is really big. You get treated better by people who are of the rank. And that helps you navigate the organization better. Ofcourse there is a lot more you are not telling us-this being a public forum. It is possible there is a legit reason you are pissed. So do what is best for you. Although as I said above, look past Quantmeh's style and listen to its content. Some lessons are best not learned the hard way. That being the default way for such lessons.

QuoteOriginally posted by: cetico i on the other hand, would hire hou to work for mefirst, get your promotion. at this point it doesnt seem like you have any hiring power.

quantmeh logic would be ok if not for one simple thing. At most places you do get a salary increase as you move up the ladder. So why be grateful and stay? Be grateful and....move on with a higher title on the CV )

QuoteOriginally posted by: ThinkDifferentmove on with a higher title on the CV )sure, stochastic dominance holds. it doesn't seem like he's getting this option though.

QuoteOriginally posted by: capafan2QuoteOriginally posted by: ceticoquantmeh, who's talking about africa here?if you would like to create a new thread about donations, the best way to help people in need etc thats absolutely fine, but this is not the topic being discussed here. If i extended your reasoning i could tell you to be grateful for being alive and stop the discussion?Don't take him(her?) seriously. He(she?) likes to needle people every once in a while. Enjoy and relax. Life (career) is too short . As you can see I am unsure about his (her?) sex. Some of his (her?) comments hinted he was a she. He (she?) even offered to be on the front page of playboy once if the money was right. Who want to see a dude in Playboy. Damn!!- the doubt never leaves me. Quantmeh can you clear it for me!!Maybe he's a heshe.And maybe the heshe uses a shepee...

Is it acceptable (by law), to be offered a promotion without a pay rise, what are your rights? Would love to hear Dominic's opinion (and this reassuringly expensive lawyers) about it...Speaking as the headhunter around here, I'd say that you have been given more money....You now have higher rank, which means that your expectation of pay when you next move has been increased, so it's net present value, not cash. Yes cash would be nice but the way it works at most firms most of the time is that next time round your expectation should have been raised by this promotion.I'm not aware of any law by which you have a right to more money if your job title changes.It could be part of evidence if at some time in the future you wanted to claim some form of sex/race/age discrimination as in "all the other SVPs in my group get X, but I get 0.8 X"Note that is evidence not proof.There is (in some countries) "constructive dismissal" which is behaviour by the employer which strikes at the heart of the contractual relationship, such as hiring you as a Quant, then transferring you to compliance with the job of filling in the paperwork necessary when someone changes jobs. How big the change needs to be for that is something you need a lawyer for.However Cetico, your life has got a bit better, OK not much better, but you're doing the same work for the same pay, so they have kept their side of the bargain.At some firms there is roughly deterministic relationship between base pay and job title for a given silo, so by their own procedures they ought to give you more money.But that's internal policy, not a legal right.There are a couple of exceptions to this, but from what he says it doesn't sound like they apply to Cetico. Some promotions at certain firms are to "partnership", sometimes this is just another rank/job title, but sometimes it means you get share of the profits and can mean that you are no longer an employee.Also, they may be trying to shaft you by moving you to a set of people who are going to be made redundant and it makes the internal politics/paperwork easier if they are of a particular kind....or it may be the exact opposite, this may be an effort to keep you in the firm.