I am almost afraid to ask this one... For those of you (if any.) with non-financial MASTERS degrees and relatively little experience, what did you have to do get hired as a quant? Did any of you manage to do it without a Ph.D? What did you do to sell yourself over others with more credentials? For those of you with Ph.D.'s who DO hire others: What convinces you to hire a master's student over a PH.D, if such a thing ever happens?I am thinking of simply trying to get an internship to begin with, unpaid if necessary. My primary goal is to get experience and worry about pay later. I need to be able to sell something, and to do that I think I should work for peanuts just to get a foot in the door. I am trying to get some more concrete strategies though...Thanks,Riaz

i suspect that unfortunately cheapness or even freeness of labour doesnt matter - we're talking about a field in which its the best people that count, little matter what they cost. even the people who are ideally qualified are hired for as good a free in the banks eyes. rather than tackle this problem of getting a quant job head-on have you thought about going for a closely related job that doesnt have such a barrier to entry, then plotting to move sideways.

Well, many of the jobs do specify a masters as a requirement rather than a Ph.D. I would imagine however, that they might wind up hiring Ph.D's anyway. I was planning on taking a couple of the actuary exams as well just to get real credentials. I think that a lot of times knowing people helps too. Basically my plan is to head out to NYC, make as many connections as I can, and hustle hustle hustle. I am expecting people to want to hire their buddy's from Carnegie Mellon or Wharton. Probably means I need to think about these schools in my future as well. I would just like to try to do something in the real world first before having to go back to school.All things said and done, I am not a big fan of the idea that the world owes me a living. If the market makes it clear that getting more education is what is required, then more education is what I will get. I just feel like I have been in school for so long, that I'd like to work before having to go back...Riaz

patch22, very good advice, and RiazA you appear to be a level headed young person which always helps in this business.In my experience all I can say is "it depends". By that I mean it depends on so many factors. - The current market, although it is picking up, has meant that banks can filter out applicants by saying PhDs only. It also filters out many wannabes from headhunters, i.e., people in the know still apply without a PhD.- It depends on the place. To get a job at Goldman or Morgan Stanley as a Quant straight out of school you need a PhD. A friend got a job in a lesser known bank with no PhD or Masters. Bright guy and knew his stuff, but straight out of school. He can now walk into another job based on his experience and reputation. Someone else I know of got a job as a Quant trader, with MSc, in a reasonably well known place. However, this person had non-Quant experience from top-tier US IB. That helps.Get to know a headhunter if possible. Not always easy, but it has helped me a lot. The fact that I was placed in a top US IB might have been a good reason why these HHs wanted to be friendly with me, but in the end we have become good friends, and one has now moved into a HR position withn a major US IB. These guys are my mates, but it may help in the near future if/when I decide to make a move, regardless of the fact that I have a PhD.But you have already identified that in your post RiazA. Sometimes "getting your foot in the door" is so important.Just give it a go. Its the only way to find out.All the best.