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nom
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Joined: May 23rd, 2007, 12:08 pm

Junior trader - what next?

June 19th, 2007, 6:18 pm

So I have been a graduate first, then junior trader, on the desk for 2 years now. The set-up here is essentially a senior trader and myself running the books. I have learned a lot so far, and it has been a terrific experience. But staying where I am, I will continue to be the one just helping out with the senior trader's books, and the learning curve will never be nearly as steep as it used to. The first option is to go and do the same sort of trading elsewhere, with a greater share of responsibility for the PnL. This is, in fact, what has been offered to me by every single headhunter that have called me. However, I feel that it may be a bit too early to run the book by myself. Especially after I have seen how difficult the business of prop trading, or making money out of thin air, can be. I would rather go for what I consider the second option. I would be keen to join a larger desk, work within a team of several talented individuals, contribute to the modelling and trading effort what I have learnt so far, and learn a lot of new stuff myself, at the same time. That would possibly involve different type of strategies to what I have been doing so far, or even perhaps a different asset class altogether.Am I right in thinking it is too early for me for the first option? (all HH's will say "no", but their view is clearly biased). I feel it would make much more sense to join a larger desk within a slightly different trading area, aiming to learn new approaches to trading. My understanding is that there comes a point in a trader's career, when you are justexpected to produce PnL and lead the development of new strategies, rather then be guided in your efforts by a senior teammember. However, I don't think this happens after one has had 2 years of trading experience. Regards
 
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bsycheng
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Joined: November 8th, 2006, 2:18 pm

Junior trader - what next?

June 20th, 2007, 8:12 am

What are you trading?Asset class?Complexity?
 
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awakebai
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Joined: June 15th, 2007, 3:23 pm

Junior trader - what next?

June 20th, 2007, 8:35 am

Hi, nom, may I ask what kind of desk are you based? Is it a buy-side one or a market-maker one? And what kind of assets do you trade? Equity? Equity derivatives? Swaps? FX? I am now applying for a buy-side junior equity trader position. I am eager to know how is a buy-side equity trader different from those in the IB acting as market makers? Hope you can help!Thanks a lot!
 
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DominicConnor
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Joined: July 14th, 2002, 3:00 am

Junior trader - what next?

June 20th, 2007, 9:52 pm

Depending of course on the product, 2 yrs is a bit fast to expect to run your own book, and I'm not really quite sure the HHs were "offering" it to you.I suspect rather that they thought it was worth a shot.I think you should continue to communicate your short term goals to the HHs, and in my experience as one, if you say something often enough to us, eventually we get the message.But HHs are brokers, not market makers, they can't create slots themselves. But a good one, with the right contacts can target a team that you want to go to, and try and open them up.That's harder, but can work nicely.In parallel with this, I wonder if your little team needs expanding ?You seem happy with your job, boss and business sector, it's only the body count that you identify as an issue.Perhaps ask your boss if that sort of change makes sense ?
 
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nom
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Joined: May 23rd, 2007, 12:08 pm

Junior trader - what next?

June 24th, 2007, 12:58 pm

Thanks. As a former HH yourself, would you say that candidates who cold-called you were somehow looked down at? I have, rather unwisely, not kept in touch with those HH's who were calling me around year-end last year (I wasn't interested in changing my job at that time). How I landed the job in the first place? very typically, recruited at the uni first, then internship resulting in a permanent job offer. I was rather obsessed with trading for several years before starting the job, had learnt a lot about pricing derivatives, basics of trading etc which I think showed on the interviews. "Live and breathe this job" is what I was told a good candidate has to do.
 
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ZmeiGorynych
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Joined: July 10th, 2005, 11:46 am

Junior trader - what next?

June 24th, 2007, 3:40 pm

Congratulations on your realism. Yeah, prop trading can be hard - even if you have a very firm idea of the strategy you want to pursue.What kind of trading are you in? How automated? What asset class? How exotic? What type of strategies? It's hard to give advice without specifics.Also you say you 'were' obsessed with trading. Does that imply you no longer are?
 
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nom
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Joined: May 23rd, 2007, 12:08 pm

Junior trader - what next?

June 26th, 2007, 6:14 pm

Equities long-short, with a degree of quantitative analysis in it, very automated, not exotic.